Transparent Reselling . . . ?
Posted by Piano, 08-23-2002, 01:53 PM How much annoniminity can a reseller have? And what things can the provider do to accomplish complete (or close to it) anoniminity? It seems like my current provider simply gave me my own name servers, that's it. Not much transparacy there... A simple DNS check easily displayed my providers name, and I'm not liking this.
Posted by MCHost-Marc, 08-23-2002, 02:05 PM Most providers are using their domain as the hostname of the server(s), such as server1.host.com which makes it traceable very easily. An anonymous hostname should do 98% of the anoniminity.
Posted by tazd9t9, 08-23-2002, 03:20 PM The companies i use have anonymous name servers. But use donhost as an example, they say they have anonymous name servers but most people know what they are, so they don't work very well.
Posted by Smokie, 08-23-2002, 03:40 PM Small hosting companys with one server have no choice. If you want to be on a anonymous server you should ask where your reseller account will be hosted.
Posted by MilkMan, 08-23-2002, 03:42 PM Yeah, always ask what the cannonical hostname will show up as.
Posted by mk123, 08-23-2002, 04:20 PM one more area people fail to see apart from anonymous nameservers is the Email header. Now-a-days, thanks to SPAMs, everyone knows about email header and uses it to report SPAM etc. Many providers domain also sneak-in in the email header.
Posted by Tapion, 08-23-2002, 06:11 PM I agree mk123, that has happened to me so many times, the host claims to be completely anonymous yet you can clearly see their domain in the mail headers, security certificates as well is a often problem. I am currently using www.wholemilk.net I pay .80c for every 50mb/1gb of space (I think they made me get at least 20gb before they offered that) but im basically completely anonymous, they use the ensim control panel and its setup for an anonymous domain, even the security certificate is anonymous, the mail headers all show up as the anonymous domain. Every program I used to try to check if anyone can tell im a Reseller just makes me look like I have a dedicated server on the EV1 Network. Oh I also ordered private name servers for my domain...you probably shouldnt use a anonymous name server makes you less credible in my opinion.
Posted by fractiousws, 08-23-2002, 07:48 PM Also, the host should not have there website on the same server as resellers. Anonymous nameservers with anonymous contact info. Also as marc mentioned anonymous hostnames.
Posted by Smokie, 08-23-2002, 08:44 PM Thats why we use Ensim it is a true resellers CP. Accounts allowing name servers and if you want to run a custom script you can install it threw ssh and customize your space to suit your needs and your clients and will not affect the rest of the server. It is as close to haveing your own dedicated as you are going to get, at a fraction of the price
Posted by mk123, 08-24-2002, 05:38 PM Tapion, wholemilk.net have Resellers plan?
Posted by Tapion, 08-24-2002, 05:47 PM sure do you have to contact them to set it up AIM: wholemilksales ICQ: 163957154
Posted by ATST, 08-24-2002, 06:43 PM An anonymous security certificate?
Posted by Tapion, 08-24-2002, 07:59 PM well yeah, its assigned to the anonymous domain which is what the control panel is on.
Posted by chrisb, 08-25-2002, 04:04 AM Watch out for those error pages too that are often a dead giveaway to the real host. Also ftp servers can give you away. Few hosts have it all covered for you.
Posted by advantagecom, 08-25-2002, 08:56 PM It is nearly impossible to cover up all tracks of the hosting company you are reselling. If the hosting company you buy your services from is worth their snot, they'll be running BGP which means all of their info is visible when *your* IP address is looked up in the ARIN whois database or the BGP routing tables. You can expose almost any reseller this way, unless the IP block the reseller is assigned gets SWIP'ed to the reseller in the ARIN whois database. Very few hosting companies do this unless you're paying big bucks and are assigned something larger than a /24 network block. But, if you don't care about that, then a dedicated server, colocated server, or (potentially) a virtually dedicated server would be your best bet. Look at spending $30 a month minimum for a good virtual dedicated server. This topic came up recently on our own forums. Basically, you need to know why you're in business and setup a business plan to accomplish that. If you're in business to provide hosting without value add services (web design and such), then you shouldn't be a reseller. Hosting is too much of a commodity these days to be able to run a successful hosting reseller business without some kind of value add. Our most successful resellers almost invariably sell hosting as an add on to their web design or web site management services. They don't sell it as their primary method of generating revenue. The absolute best way to sell just hosting without the value add is to actually become a real hosting company and forget about reselling. Just be prepared for a rough ride and lots of capital outlay before you see any returns.
Posted by merconline, 08-28-2002, 07:17 AM advantagecom ppl are not expecting 100% anonymity... as they also know the limitations. As the poster asked how much?? basic anonymity should be there like ping your domain, or nameservers or cpanel should not show ur domain or in email headers which mk123 has pointed out. or when resold domains try to access their control panel, it should not have link or reference to the provider's domain. If these basic things are not tackled, which makes even a kid to guess the provider, then it's not a anonymous reseller account at all. some provider don't tackle these small things also and claim anonymous!! even give private nameservers for the name of anonymity, which in my opinion is useless if the basic points are not covered up properly.
Posted by chrisb, 08-28-2002, 07:22 AM I disagree. I think most resellers do expect total anonymity.
Posted by merconline, 08-28-2002, 09:31 AM yup for me also if 101% anonymity then best!! thats the best situation! my point was if cannot make even 10% anonymous, then should not claim in the website as anonymous reseller plan.
Posted by markcw, 08-28-2002, 07:04 PM Anonymous should be EXPECTED!! No hard feeling with the current web host, but I will make sure the next one will discuss what is not hidden from my customers.
Posted by krondorian, 08-29-2002, 04:06 AM Not sure if I am correct about this. I use Voxtreme and they allow me to setup my own nameservers as ns1.asiahost.net and ns2.asiahost.net. So in my scenario, I guess I get 100% anonimity since I handle my own billing, tech support, domain registrations, etc. Fact is alot of hosts that offer reseller plans can do this. Not all, but most should be able to offer private label nameservers. Regards, Paul Leong Last edited by Chicken; 09-04-2002 at 01:32 AM.
Posted by mk123, 08-29-2002, 09:29 AM voxtreme.com comes under the 98% anonymous. They use unbranded dnsxxxx.com as their host. But maybe if power users ARIN etc. then can find Voxtreme's name (the 2% cases) Last edited by mk123; 08-29-2002 at 03:10 PM.
Posted by chrisb, 08-29-2002, 02:08 PM I don't think that was a good idea to post your host's anonymous server names. If everybody knows them, then it sorta defeats the purpose, just like everyone knows who uses propagation.net.
Posted by mk123, 08-29-2002, 02:44 PM uhh... sorry abt that.. edited.. it hope its ok now Last edited by mk123; 08-29-2002 at 03:11 PM.
Posted by MAX POWER, 09-01-2002, 08:54 AM Mmmm...Interesting phenomenon is Anonimity!
Posted by MotleyFool, 09-04-2002, 12:56 AM Actually Anonymity is no big deal. The host should have a domain name like dnsanon.com or something with internic whois data untraceable to him/her. And then set up the server with a hostname from dnsanon.com, server name in ProFTPd, nameservers, everything on dnsanon.com. And have a bland page at http://dnsanon.com like "Welcome to DNSAnon Server Cluster!" or something. And this can be done for 1 server or 100 servers with 1 domain name